Leo 04, 01 / Jun 21, 17 13:28 UTC

What complete rubbish!  

There are so many things wrong with this constitution. A kingdom with no king? Ascaridia on other celestial bodies? If you're going to have a kingdom at least call them principalities. Age limits? Are you serious? At a time when the entire concept of age and human lifespan is being redefined. A national bank in the era of blockchains and crowdfunding? I'm disappointed that the best governmental structure that could be imagined is an antiquated parliamentary one. There are many concepts that have no place in a forward-looking constitution. Race being one of them, there is only one race, the human race(comprised solely of Homo Sapiens at the moment but that can and will change at some point). Mentioning race is just stupid, better to just say "for any Conceivable reason not related to personal choice." Don't even mention religion except to ban its mention in government, those terrestrial flames do not need to be given oxygen in space. I could go on but I'll just end with one final point. To mention freedom of speech in one line and to limit it in another is by and of itself fascist. 


P.S. I'm surprised and a little shocked that not a single word was mentioned regarding the rights of the impending sentient machines not to mention forms of sentient life not yet discovered or encountered. I guess I just set my hopes to high.

Leo 04, 01 / Jun 21, 17 15:17 UTC

@ jnittner(Asgardian) on 21 June 2017, 1:28 p.m.

P.S. I'm surprised and a little shocked that not a single word was mentioned regarding the rights of the impending sentient machines not to mention forms of sentient life not yet discovered or encountered. I guess I just set my hopes to high.

Hi Jnittner. Welcome to Asgardia.Space! For the topic of recognizing sentient machines, there have been mentions allocating rights to Artificially Intelligent machines in the past months. I might point out that "discovered alien intelligence" in Article §6 can include such A.I. beings. From a practical stand point, we don't have a need to have this definition that explicit at this time. The laws and Constitution can be amended at a later date when that proves necessary.

  Last edited by:  Richie Bartlett (Asgardian)  on Leo 04, 01 / Jun 21, 17 15:17 UTC, Total number of edits: 1 time

Leo 04, 01 / Jun 21, 17 16:15 UTC

@LoreZyra
Curious find today! I noticed they have changed the current Constitution. It’s more than just a common courtesy to let people know there is new version. Given that these changes were made during the established voting period, it is highly doubtful that people who voted prior to these changes were made aware. Furthermore, per standard Contract law, all parties to an existing contract must be made aware of such changes regardless if they are pending or approved.  Such notice should be made with sufficient notice in time! I have not seen any notice to the fact from any official sources.

Don't you think, @LoreZyra, that the Constitutional draft, in the way it was proposed to asgardians, should have contained a "digital signature" (or at least an hash) to prevent people thinking to vote for something, and later found themselves voting something completely different?
Would like to read @Stryx's comment also about that.

Leo 04, 01 / Jun 21, 17 16:36 UTC

Honestly the only reason I mention it is to show respect for other forms of sentience which might actually prevent wars. Because it's human nature to fear and distrust that which is not like us, whether we like it or not. And if Asguardia is truly to protect earth it must be prepared for this contingency. 

Leo 05, 01 / Jun 22, 17 07:58 UTC

@jnitter, why care of AI? You can just unplug the bloody basterds. Organics dont hve an off switch. 

Leo 05, 01 / Jun 22, 17 08:03 UTC

@Elwe Thor, like the idea of an "ESig" for the Constitution document..

Leo 05, 01 / Jun 22, 17 08:03 UTC

[remove duplicate]

  Last edited by:  Temir Rakitin (Asgardian)  on Leo 05, 01 / Jun 22, 17 08:04 UTC, Total number of edits: 1 time
Reason: remove duplicate

Leo 05, 01 / Jun 22, 17 21:22 UTC

So Asgardia is a kingdom and Igor was voted in? I must have missed that while I was reading the decree from Igor saying that Igor was head of nation. That would make the figure of people who voted for him (upwards of 100k) a complete lie would it not?

Also, lower age limits on governmental positions is ageist in the extreme! If there is an age of majority (18 for example) then anyone who has reached that age should be treated as an equal adult in all respects. 

I will NOT sign off on this travesty of a document! Especially a document that has no option to reject it!

Leo 05, 01 / Jun 22, 17 22:56 UTC

@Bozz,

As you correctly recall, there was no election on January 20, 2017. You had a checkbox where you agreed to call Dr. Ashurbeyli the Head of Nation. If you didn't agree, you would not be allowed access to any of the website's resources. Just like June 13-now, you had an OPT-IN service. You had to click an agreement button. As this is not a real vote, there is no reject/NO option. It's an EULA that you either agree or leave. I've read one of the moderators argue how the NO "vote" was of zero value and therefore useless to collect. For a society that claims to love science and all therein, I find that preposterous. They have no idea who is abstaining and who actively reject the document. They are forced to assume that abstain and reject votes are the same. 

From an entrepreneural view, this is retarded. If you are launching a new service or product and you know 240K+ people have expressed interest, but only 30-50K people are actually buying, why would you not listen/survey the people to find how to make it more amenable? It seems to me, there is a significant disconnect between the management of this project and the people that love the dream. A severe lack of direct communications that will ultimately kill it.

I would wonder if all future “elections” would follow this emerging pattern. OPT-IN only votes?

  Last edited by:  Richie Bartlett (Asgardian)  on Leo 06, 01 / Jun 23, 17 09:31 UTC, Total number of edits: 4 times
Reason: corrected typos

Leo 05, 01 / Jun 22, 17 23:00 UTC

I just now noticed... This discussion is no longer in the Constitution forum...

@Civic.Asgardia:

Why was the "Discussion of the Second draft Constitution" thread moved from the Constitution forum to Petitions?


  Last edited by:  Richie Bartlett (Asgardian)  on Leo 06, 01 / Jun 23, 17 09:28 UTC, Total number of edits: 2 times
Reason: Updated color format; found 4th version - June 23

Leo 06, 01 / Jun 23, 17 04:21 UTC

This was a poll... how it became a petition? does they even know the difference?

Leo 06, 01 / Jun 23, 17 07:57 UTC

@Jason Rainbow(Asgardian, Global Admin) on 23 June 2017, 7:07 a.m.

Sorry guys, this was moved to the petitions forum as it was assumed from conversation that it was a discussion in concert with the current petition on this subject.  

We are sorry if this assumption was incorrect.


I have moved this post back to the Constitutional forum.

Hi @Jason Rainbow. Thanks for moving this thread back. I do have it in mind to create a number of Petitions. However, as done over the last several months, I felt it necessary to have an open discussion on each point of the Constitution for which many people feel need to be addressed. If you prefer, I could break this discussion up into separate posts concentrated on individual Articles of the document. What do you think?

Leo 07, 01 / Jun 24, 17 06:23 UTC

Yo Mate, doesnt look like the Empire cares about your question nor your bloody quest...

Leo 07, 01 / Jun 24, 17 10:59 UTC

LoreZyra Count me in on your petitions. You work clearly reflects the general consensus more than what we've been handed, and with better attention to detail.

  Last edited by:  Stephen Howell (Asgardian)  on Leo 07, 01 / Jun 24, 17 11:03 UTC, Total number of edits: 1 time

Leo 07, 01 / Jun 24, 17 17:49 UTC

@markjcooke
You know the saying: what's the definition of insanity...when you keep  trying the same thing over and over and expecting different results

I've to say I'm guilty too: even if terribly few, I didn't lost all hopes the administration will start to listen to us... but I'm near to follow you (maybe saving myself from insanity).