Hello all!

There have been some interesting conversations about ideas for the future justice system of Asgardia. Once we do become a full nation it's something that will need to be considered, so please put your thoughts and ideas below.

Remember to keep the discussion civil and respectful of other Asgardians.

Kind regards,

Rebekah Berg, Lead Community Administrator, Asgardia

How will any posts made in this thread be forwarded to Dr. Ashurbeyli?

I am formally demanding a full explanation of the feedback process, including all steps and the names and positions of all people involved.

This is the beginning of the future justice system of Asgardia, full public accountability of all public officials and policies.  Without that, we will not conform to international law as it regards to the execution of justice.

Comment deleted

... or a religious system "shoot them all and let god do the judging" :)

@Clive

>Will it be like the French system "Everything is illegal until a law is passed to make it legal" or the English system. "Everything is legal until a law is passed to make it illegal"

Since one of the tenets of Asgardia is that it is supposed to be an "unrestricted society,"  the English system sounds more plausible.  Also, I think we should have a way to prevent the passing of petty laws.

I think crimes that cause little to no direct primary harm (e.g; paraphilias such as Necrophilia) should be legal and regulated.

See: https://asgardia.space/en/forum/forum/criminal-justice-25/topic/the-asgardian-cjs-on-necrophilia-4669/

The premise of a legal system is one where all persons are considered equal under the rule of law in all aspects of their life and with minimal interference from the government.

Whether that is commerce, criminal proceedings, civil proceedings, or personal dealings, the government's role should be to consider all issues of a given matter, weigh both sides as well as the public interest, and then make a ruling based on all three factors (both sides and the public interest).

It is not the role of the government to tell people what they are allowed to do. Under such a system, innovation is impossible because you cannot make a law to tell people they are allowed to do something which has never been done before, nor imagined. Thus, a system where all things are allowed until a law is written against them would allow innovation. There should be a caveat, however, where behaviors against the common health and safety of Asgardians are considered illegal, to prevent people from being careless.

LEQ

I have not studied law myself nor been subpoenaed for jury duty, but my one of the Professors in forensic science that I'm currently studying under told a story today that is worth thinking about. He told of a colleague of his who is also a Professor in forensic science and well versed in the language and the science behind forensic evidence, and she was called in to sit as a juror for a drug case. She said that it was horrifying to serve with the other jurors, "recruited" from all kinds of professions and walks of life, because they misunderstood and misinterpreted so much of the forensic evidence put forward. The professor had to constantly school them in how to interpret the statistical evidence and not to misuse it. If she hadn't been there the outcome could have been catastrophic.

The point of the story seems to indicate to me that the juror system that many countries use today is severely flawed, it was originally instated so that we could be judged by our peers, unfortunately most of our peers are immensely unfit to make appropriate judgement based on scientific evidence. Now, you might argue that this will be less of a problem in a nation full of scientists as Asgardia might become, but it still something important to discuss.

So what am I suggesting? Either constantly have a pool of jurors that will be educated on how to interpret forensic evidence before they're but on a chair in a courtroom, or even make juror a professional profession. As it stands in many countries today, loads of professions are excluded from juror duty thus hardly making it by 'peer' anyway, so it might as well be its own profession!

I think this is incredibly important to discuss, because I know people who have been wrongfully sentenced because of the idiocy of the jurors and I for one refuse to have a justice system where I can be imprisoned for a crime I didn't commit simply because a juror didn't know better.

Peace and love

@RenSix, this story is very close to an experience my wife had with jury duty. She had the dubious honour of being appointed foreperson an at the fist break (before any of the evidence was heard) one of her fellow jurors made the comment "Well, he looks guilty".

Jury trials are where the defendant's fate rests in the hands of 12 people too stupid to get out of jury duty. In their current form, they really should have no place in an advanced society.

I personally believe that it shouldn't have a place in any judiciary system. The juror system makes me cringe. It seems like the most ridiculous option out there: "let completely inexperienced or uneducated people judge". No, thank you. The romantic idea of being judged by your peers doesn't compel me at all.

Let's do it right, with qualified professionals as judges. What stipulates qualified? I don't know, I guess some education in the field of law would be good. Oh, wait, I study law? What a coincidence... ;)

My take on this is that for the justice system to be efficient in it's dealings with the general population of Asgardia, it has to be re-active and not pro-active - as  a pro-active system will limit or ban actions that are needed to evolve the society as time or situations changes.

A re-active system will gather all information ( even by holding a referendum) to get the idea of the general population to situations that might arise that is new of unforeseen, before a decision is made - a decision that may be taken up on appeal.

This will allow the Asgardian society to grow and change a the need arises.

Kind Regards

I hope to not sound naïve but jury service does mean, in my own opinion, that people who can hold 12 different biases deciding upon guilt spreads the opinions more equally than say one judge who may hold a single bias that has the "power" of 12 biases thus resulting in the chance that if the judge holds a bias of guilt, then the person would be more likely to be called guilty than innocent. Furthermore, might having people judged by their peers mean that each juror has a 8.3% stake in whether the accused is guilty of innocent rather than the judges 100% stake. 

I just hope that they ban pedophiles

Will the guilty be sent back to earth and let a trial happen on their behalf? You know to keep the flow of Asgardia progress flowing!

Laws must be based on morals and our over all purpose as a nation. Anything that can be considered immoral must be banned, from necrophilia to pedophilia. Anything that is considered too weird, selfish, or evil for the common good must never be allowed to be legal. Not to mention unlike other nations this nation serves a direct purpose. It is not just so people can try and shape it to get away with whatever they want. It must be based around the ideas of protecting the earth and nothing else. If something will wreck morale than yes ban it.