Jul 15, 01 / Jul 30, 17 13:58 UTC

ARTICLE - Asgardia Makes the Leap to 178th Population Size!  

Good day Asgardia!

We have a new article up on the Asgardia.space website! Our total membership brings our population number up to 178th in the world!

https://asgardia.space/en/page/chronicles/asgardia-makes-another-leap-in-population-size 

  Last edited by:  Rebekah Berg (Asgardian, Lead Admin)  on Jul 15, 01 / Jul 30, 17 14:01 UTC, edited 1 time in total.

Jul 18, 01 / Aug 2, 17 06:51 UTC

恭喜! 

Aug 7, 01 / Aug 19, 17 18:31 UTC

Awesome when do we launch into space.

Aug 7, 01 / Aug 19, 17 21:26 UTC

May I ask you why, if from Asgardia own statements 

Those who vote in support of the Declaration of Unity of Asgardia and the Constitution of Asgardia will pass on the third level of certication [citizens] and receive the right for an Asgardia ID card. In the case of disagreement with the Declaration of Unity of Asgardia and the Constitution of Asgardia, the individual will remain on the second level of verication.[visitors]
(decree n. 3, Voting Regulations, art. 5)

you're counting as "population" even the visitors? In my humble opinion, only the citizens should be counted (at least all other nations are doing that) so, with the currently 108.735 citizens, where does Asgardia falls back? As far as I can see, from the list in the home page, 191 position, between Saint Vincent (109k) and Grenada (107k).

Aug 8, 01 / Aug 20, 17 09:35 UTC

Ahhh... my everlasting fan, Jason... so, now, we've been promoted "non-permanent residents"... "on preferential basis" I bet, as that goes into Asgardia's interest.
But, when I post something 1 millimeter off the CoC I'm considered back a "visitor" right?.. promoted or demoted where the best interest of Asgardia stay.
Needless to say that only in some countries, "visitors" are counted as "residents"... pretty sure you would include Asgardia so, what a pity it's not a country, uh?

Aug 8, 01 / Aug 20, 17 23:34 UTC

@jasonrainbow - with all due respect, where in the world did you get that information from?  Is that something you thought should be the case or is it something you can be sure of from definitions of population of citizens by various governments.  I know for a fact that Australia, singapore, china, india, malaysia, indonesia, austria, iceland and sweden don't do as you seem to think. They are quite strict about the definition of citizenship.  Given that this constitutes a very large percentage of the worlds population I would think your comparison to what is only possible that USA might do would seem to be somewhat blinkered? And that is only if USA does do what you describe, which is possible, however doubtful.

I'm not having a go at you so please don't take offense, however, incorrect and non-factual answers to questions on this forum do not in any way help the image of Asgardia. In posting those answers you are not "protecting" Asgardia in any way. What you are doing as a "global moderator" is making it visible that we look like a bunch of amateur crackpots who have no understanding of the consequences of what Dr Ashurbeyli has proposed to do here.

You don't need to take my advice, but I implore you to not answer questions when you are not in possession of all the facts and don't have the experience or knowledge. It is better to let something like @ElweThore said just "slide on by" than to answer with incorrect or non-factual, emotion driven nonsense.  The best defense you have for Asgardia is to let people play themselves out by not answering them.  This approach at least makes Asgardia look like it is above petty infighting.

Aug 9, 01 / Aug 21, 17 06:54 UTC

Australia does not.

Andrew Gillard

Aug 9, 01 / Aug 21, 17 08:28 UTC

I'm sorry, Jason, and while I admire the mirror climbing's mastery (and I'm sorry to say that, but this is not the first time you move forward a completely illusory idea, just as it goes in the (doubtful) interest of Asgardia), I've to say that, from Asgardia's own word, the Head of Nation's ones (which, I'm confident, you believe), we that didn't sign the Constitutional draft are "visitors" (decree n. 3, Voting Regulations art. 5 states "second level of verication", so "users", not "citizens"), not "residents": I've no room, so no "residency", into Asgardia-1, the same as I've no room, just an account (you can ban on will, as I've no rights too), into Asgardia. I'm even not an "immigrant", short or long term one, as I never asked Asgardia's citizenship. I'm a "visitor" (look at my current avatar), looking to the (terrible) situation, hoping it will evolve in better, but really not sure it will do, especially if so much lies are spreaded day by day.

But, as you're doing so fine-grained distinctions, why not counting ALL the users then, even the L1 ones? cleaning the total from the many who left, you should reach at least 700.000, making Asgardia to jump forward a lot: at least before Montenegro, 164th position... isn't it much better than 178th? ;-)))
If you're thinking of "people who had the voting rights", I'm sorry, but I've to sink that idea too: having only an "acceptance", not a real "vote", I never had that right: Asgardia's platform stripped my rights off when decided to avoid inserting the "yes and no" options (breaking its own laws, while doing it).

So, Jason, the problem stays exactly in the terms @bigred explained so well: to be honest, counting the real/certified citizens (thus falling back to 191th position, if anyone cares about that, administration apart), or to be fancy, spreading some other lies, keeping in count "whatever it fits, in a defined moment, so to put some smoke into others' eyes"?
As usual, as we're democratic dissidents, and not autoritarian king's esquires, the answer is at you.

P.S. @Andromandy
your avatar made me laughing... right before to recognize how true it is. ;-)

Aug 10, 01 / Aug 22, 17 02:02 UTC

We are going to explain and illuminate a little about the asgardia community in simple summary there are only 200 people willing to be able to realize the dream of a terrestrial base for asgardia obviously having a land base it is necessary that these people have a house, a health system , Education and in addition terner people willing to provide security to that hypothetical and despised ground base was being considered in the future to put that terrestrial base as point of connection and immigration of the earth to celestial asgard by means of a space elevator, although we are separated by The circumstances always the first intention was to work in conjunction with asgardia space but after the events occurred I think it is recommended that this corporate entity remain independent of asgardia space

Aug 10, 01 / Aug 22, 17 06:55 UTC

@jasonrainbow - sorry mate but you were very definitely talking about citizenship. 

I have no desire to create an argument on here however you need to stop defending and start thinking clearly.  I say this only in the desire to ensure that Asgardia does not look foolish in front of those who may be interested for one reason or another.

"In most countries the resident and non-permanent population count is included in the general population statistics if they are resident in the "place" for more than a set period of time or if they happen to be a resident at the time of a national census"

This was your response to a query from @elwethor questioning why the Asgardia.space website was not comparing Asgardian citizens with the published citizen populations of other nations.

The comparison of Asgardia to other nations is based on other nations published citizenship figures.  Please do not make the situation more embarrassing by trying to deny that your contention with @elwethor was that you believed the population statistics shown by other nations includes all types of individuals who would not normally be classed as citizens. That is, individuals who stayed in one place for a period of time or have permanent residence status and/or various other situations as described by yourself in your original post.

You as a "Global Moderator" should be setting the highest standard of maturity, impartiality and broad-mindedness.

Quite simply you were incorrect and the sensible and mature thing to do is just admit it and be done with it. Defending an incorrect position will never make it correct and will never make Asgardia look good. It will only ever serve to encourage individuals who already see inaccuracies and difficulties to ridicule you and Asgardia further, just as @elwethor has handed out to you in his last post.  

Census results give all sorts of information depending on what the govt of a particular nation is looking to study for societal infrastructure or improvement. One of the pieces of information on any population census is how many people living in the country are citizens - and sometimes how many outside of the country are citizens. Census results are sometimes used to update population statistics at the respective country's department of births, deaths and marriages (or whatever they have in each country). However published citizenship population statistics are not to my knowledge ever inclusive of statuses other than citizens.

  Last edited by:  bigred (Asgardian)  on Aug 10, 01 / Aug 22, 17 07:09 UTC, edited 2 times in total.

Aug 10, 01 / Aug 22, 17 13:42 UTC

@Jason Rainbow
The topic of this post is about POPULATION, so the number of open registered accounts on the site,  not about statistical population comparison which would include ratios of "citizens" to "residents" and "tourists" .

So, if the topic was about "asgardians", as it happens one can write "there are 109.270 asgardians" (today citizens' count) Asgardia should be awarded to be the "1st nation in the World" as no others count "asgardians" (even if they have for sure). ;-)))
Jason, I repeat, I appreciate very much the mirror climbing mastery but, as @bigred wrote twice, try to give a "serious vision" of Asgardia, at least to whom is looking from outside: don't forget that, 'cause of its "experimental" nature, Asgardia is looked by many more than we're aware of (just to say, don't forget the ones who warned you about the (C)opyright materials stored into Asgardia-1: what a shame you had to read that from outside, before to realize there was something smelling bad).
The "voting masquerade" didn't give a very nice show of Asgardia's fairness and laws' respect, try not to add things over things, when one, even if a visitor, make you to notice discrepancies like this one.

Aug 10, 01 / Aug 22, 17 23:45 UTC

Listen guys, I'm not going to continue to argue a moot point. Your position is indefensible for a number of reasons which you would realise if you stopped looking to justify and defend.  Personally I do not understand the need to defend an obvious error in judgement and I can't actually believe you think that published citizenry population statistics include non-citizens.

1) you only have to go to a few different country's govt websites and you can find the answer rather than continuously questioning and defending.

2) Even without going to any website logic tells you that if every country included their citizens plus the non-citizens who happen to be in the country for a period of time, the population of the world will be overstated dramatically by the considerable number of people who are non-citizens staying in another country.  This is not a trivial figure, it is very material. The material nature of this figure is one of the main reasons why censuses look to define the number. It is in order to ensure the resources of a community are not stretched and citizens are not disadvantaged in resource utilisation. This allows for planning of a community infrastructure to cover for all contingencies.

So rather than debate and defend a position without knowledge by endeavouring to use school yard bullying tactics of continuously throwing out the same un-analysed questions etc in the hope you can find something in my answer to ridicule, why don't you go and do some research as I have done and learn. 

They hide that knowledge in books and on google you know?!

@jasonrainbow - your attempts to change the meaning and intent of your original post don't do you justice as the person of reason that you have been in a lot of forum arguments. Please stop it now it is somewhat embarrassing.

@protean - there is no need for you to wade into a situation which has nothing to do with you and can only cause further unrest in the forum community by prolonging and expanding a somewhat personalised debate between the original participants.  If you wish to be the voice of reason then I would think the most appropriate response is to stay quiet or to remind the participants that personal argument in this media is not conducive to a good image for Asgardia (in which case you would be correct).

@elwethor - please stop goading these guys. While it may be amusing it probably only achieves wider level dislike of all involved and polarisation which leads to further senseless remarks by people who (while thinking they are helping a situation) lash out in posts with unbridled emotion rather than thinking the situation through with their heads.

  Last edited by:  bigred (Asgardian)  on Aug 10, 01 / Aug 22, 17 23:47 UTC, edited 1 time in total.

Aug 11, 01 / Aug 23, 17 02:55 UTC

@bigred
Well, you know, I can just try to explain my original reasonment, and you also explained far better than me but, if they don't want to understand but just argue, it's useless.

Aug 11, 01 / Aug 23, 17 03:21 UTC

@bigred: 

Ok let me clarify something for you as the Australian Bureau of Statistics is by your logic also wrong. Take a look at the 2016 census data, ABS counted around 23.4 Mio. people that lived in Australia at the time of the count and reading the glossary of the 2016 census dictionary, this is what it says: The Estimated Resident Population (ERP) is the official  measure of the population of Australia, and is based on the concept of  usual residence. It refers to all people, regardless of nationality,  citizenship or legal status, who usually live in Australia, with the  exception of foreign diplomatic personnel and their families. 

This one's also for you Elwe Thor since you stated that all other nations only count citizens and you couldn't be bothered giving a source of the erroneous statement you made near the start of this thread.

Jason Rainbow is right in his statement.

And @bigred, you're in no position to tell me (or anyone for that matter) not to join into a public discussion. If you want to talk to a couple of people only and you cannot stand it if someone from a pool of nearly 300.000 users writes something you happen to disagree with, nobody forces you to reply.


  Last edited by:  Mohawk (Asgardian)  on Aug 11, 01 / Aug 23, 17 03:57 UTC, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: typos

Aug 12, 01 / Aug 24, 17 10:03 UTC

In my view , more people would register to be Asgardian from all walks of life ,all kinds of people from all over the world, all kinds of Ideologies,all kinds of motives etc. It would end  up with natural earthly  social interaction ..  It would be tough jobs for leaders.