Jan 2, 17 / Aqu 02, 01 15:14 UTC

bug tracking system  

Why we do not use some bug tracking system yet?.

May be we use something like Trac it´s easy and powerful and you can asign some problem to the correct support for example.

If you need some help with this or other configuration please tell me.

I would be delighted to be able to collaborate with the project.

- Jason Rainbow 04 January 2017 @ 02:43 am

  Last edited by:  Jason Rainbow (Global Admin, Global Mod, Asgardian)  on Jan 4, 17 / Aqu 04, 01 02:45 UTC, Total number of edits: 1 time

Jan 3, 17 / Aqu 03, 01 00:22 UTC

We could use Github issues (free) too. Don't know about https://trac.edgewall.org/ but it seems cool, open source. Never used it.

http://www.capterra.com/bug-tracking-software/spotlight/123548/YouTrack/JetBrains seems good too, free version available and a paid version too.

Jan 3, 17 / Aqu 03, 01 00:27 UTC

Greetings. Bugs are handled by Asgardia IT Team. We're in constant communication with them and all issues are investigated right away. There are also a number of new features in the pipeline, but it'll take some time to implement them all, as you can imagine. Thank you.

Jan 3, 17 / Aqu 03, 01 20:13 UTC

The current main issue Alex, is not that bug aren't reported to the IT team, it's more that there is no visibility nor communication whatsoever about how it's being dealt with.

Currently, people report bugs to you and you report them back to the IT team, but we don't get feedback. Feedback is important, it's what makes the end-user feel useful about reporting bugs in the first place. If we don't get any feedback, people will tend not to invest themself anymore, because they will feel like it has no effect and that it is pointless.

That's why using a dedicated tool where to report bugs, see they are assigned, fixed, etc. (basically a status changed) is important. And quite useful as well to have a bit of tracking.

Jan 4, 17 / Aqu 04, 01 20:47 UTC

@ Alex_Fiume, it's true that I just started participating in the project recently, so I'm asking you: is there a problem for us to get to know the IT team or interact with it? By your response I feel that we speak of an elite group that is unattainable for the rest of us.

I think it is beneficial for everyone that we can help and discuss ideas if necessary.

Jan 4, 17 / Aqu 04, 01 22:58 UTC

@Sultanovich - As you can imagine, There are thousands of active users on the forums. And with any organisation (or country), there needs to be a coordinated approach and response to all escalations.

We are part of a dedicated team of volunteers who coordinate all aspects of this forum and relevant Asgardian Chapters and remaining Facebook Groups. We are by no means an elite group. I myself, as a member of the volunteer staff, do not have contact with the Asgardia IT team. This too is escalated through the current processes.

Much to our delight, there have been a huge response to reporting bugs with the forums as well as suggestions for future enhancements. Of all the reports / requests, these must be triaged and prioritised, consideration also we have just had the holiday season.

You can see a consolidated list of all the requests to date at the following link which has been created by one of our wonderful volunteers: https://asgardia.space/en/forum/forum/feedback-11/topic/forum-feedbacksuggestions-list-322/

Additionally, There is a thread highlighting some of the works in the pipeline for the forums. While this list is by no means all that is being worked on, it highlights some of the work being undertaken. https://asgardia.space/en/forum/forum/feedback-11/topic/changes-in-the-pipeline-777/

Everyone will be advised on new features as they are launched. We also ask for your understanding that in some cases it is not possible for us to update every single bug report or suggestion due to the sheer volume recieved.

Jan 5, 17 / Aqu 05, 01 12:35 UTC

@Alan_Player, I understand what you are saying and I agree that it is necessary to keep an order. What I say is that without access to the IT team we are only users reporting errors.

If we could contact them maybe we could solve some of the problems/proposals that we reported or we could even participate in the team itself. Maybe this should be done by volunteering by mail to adminteam@asgardia.space, but I don´t know exactly.

This is a totally personal opinion, I think that both for the IT team and for the user who wants to report a bug an error tracking system is necessary.

It would also be very helpful to know with which operating system and applications we are working to be able to offer suitable solutions.

Jan 7, 17 / Aqu 07, 01 00:00 UTC

If instead of using a "bug tracking system" we simply deployed a "ticketing system" (and seriously, who is responsible for launching public-facing services without? That's not a rhetorical question. These are not new toys, and used minimally as "customer service" in many industries outside IT) it'd be possible to not only provide tracking to issues and resolutions/solutions with the forums, but all facets of infrastructure. It can extend a lot further than "bugs". Keeping it all "in house" too. And if used, it would be possible update every single bug report, as it is adressed. Regardless of volume received. It would also help reduce the volume by grouping many reports of the same problem in the same place. Long story short, there's a reason this is considered default payload in most sane deployments.

If there's one thing we can be assured of by provided examples, the "IT team" isn't "elite". I doubt they are unattainable either, I've just not placed any effort into obtaining their identities. Maybe soon.

If all issues are investigated "right away", then why am I still waiting - a few weeks later - for a response with regards to the methodologies and techniques employed in order to secure the data obtained from the users? Or what they've done about this data they've given to third parties. I'm honeslty expected to believe their typing abilities are that poor? Or am I to correctly assume this is a subject that has been lent absolutely zero thought, and the lack of response is to avoid the embaressment of admitting it whilst they educate themselves on a topic they should of been conversant with before starting (lack of is evidenced in many ways, from attempting to deploy on Amazon's cloud to using a commercial spam engine to track signups through to deploying services that have no assured authentication, and many stops between) and desperately attempt to rectify mistakes. Or worse, ignore them.

The time taken to deploy features could be massively reduced by utilising those within our number able to do something about that. Collaborational tools would also greatly assist. Many hands make light work. As suggested, if details was to be divulged - as opposed to guessing it's i7-6700/Xeon E3-1275 v5, between 32GB and 64GB of RAM, 2x 4TB HD pushed through a 1Gbps pipe, runninng FreeBSD providing ngnix supplying Drupal8 - then we'd be able to deploy VM's of precisely the same setup for testing - Ensuring potential solutions/enhancements submitted are compatible, and functional OOTB.

Jan 9, 17 / Aqu 09, 01 14:18 UTC

I just sent an email to try to contact the IT team and we can at least know firsthand what we are currently working with.

I hope to have an answer these days and that we can soon sit down to have a beer to celebrate.

Jan 10, 17 / Aqu 10, 01 01:21 UTC

Good luck.

I wouldn't hold my breath if I was you. First email I'd sent on that subject was months back, tho this wasn't to the "IT team" directly, such things not being advertised.

A responsible "IT team" would be regularly checking the feedback section for bug reports - and thusly would of been aware of these questions for some time....

  Updated  on Jan 10, 17 / Aqu 10, 01 01:25 UTC, Total number of edits: 1 time
Reason: Additional data

Jan 10, 17 / Aqu 10, 01 02:34 UTC


Thank you very much for your feedback. However, it is felt that posting known bugs would be a security risk as it may encourage others to take advantage of them. However, there are a few things I can tell you about our system.

The team is based out of Europe, they use Jira to track bugs and communicate updates and fixes through to us. I have a counterpart who communicates with them in their timezone and keeps me updated in changes and with whom I report new ones to.

I also have my own less involved system of tracking bugs to follow up on and I communicate all new ones that come up as soon as I am able. I do have a backup in case I am unavailable when a critical bug comes up and it can be reported to the IT team in a timely manner.

There are certain members of our moderator team who scan and record feedback and bugs posted on the forum. These are, again, tracked by our own tracking means and also put in a priority queue for the IT team through Jira.

However, we will be updating the 'In the Pipeline' post in the coming days as the IT team will be reviewing the great suggestions from the community and start prioritizing some for development and implementation.

Kind regards,
Rebekah Berg, Lead Community Administrator, Asgardia

  Last edited by:  Rebekah Berg (Asgardian, Lead Admin)  on Jan 10, 17 / Aqu 10, 01 02:35 UTC, Total number of edits: 1 time

Jan 10, 17 / Aqu 10, 01 14:33 UTC

@Rebekah, thank you for sharing with us some more information.

I hope you understand that what we are trying to do is to participate in the project, not to criticize the things that have been done.

I share the response that I have sent Ryan Zohar by mail to my query about the IT team:

 Currently we don’t really have a place for an IT team. Eventually we will be purchasing our own server, and then we will need help setting it up. If you’re interested in assisting Asgardia, please contact Rebekah Berg or post your intentions on the Asgardia General Official facebook page.

One thing to keep in mind is that because we do not publish the information of asgardia does not mean that we will avoid the security risks. The security by darkness stopped working since the internet became massive.

What I would like is to be able to know what we are currently working on, if we already have a specific need and how to contact the current IT team to assess which is the best solution for each case.

Schedule can be a big problem when you have work teams distributed around the planet. That is why it is important that the method of communication be as clear as possible to avoid delays or duplicate efforts in the same task.

A clear example is Jira that you just comment that is what they are using:

** Are you using a trial version or are you using it in the cloud?.

** Do we already have any equipment donated to start with our infrastructure? (Physical or virtual).

** Have you thought about giving the whole community access to any of these tools to improve processes?.

Jan 10, 17 / Aqu 10, 01 15:30 UTC

Sultanovich, let's not confuse topics. That reply was sent in response to your query to Voices of Asgardia, which does not need an IT team. While Asgardia.space has endorsed VOA, the development of the station is under private development and does not require the services of an IT Professional at this time.

In fact, the reason I pointed you to the general page is because it is a great place to get started. I never once discouraged you from pursuing an IT position, I simply stated that I was not in need of one.

Jan 11, 17 / Aqu 11, 01 06:58 UTC

Very amusing.

 However, it is felt that posting known bugs would be a security risk as it may encourage others to take advantage of them.

So, what you're basically telling me is that cisco, google, apple, akamai, microsoft, sun, vovlo - basically anyone anywhere that takes what they do even slightly seriously are all actually being intentionally insecure?

No, what actually happens is anyone with any sense uses that data to actually fix the problems - and if they're doing their job properly they can get it fixed, and roll out updates before anyone can "take advantage of them". It's really not an abnormal concept and only really not practiced by those who are destined only failure. Hoping someone doesn't "take advantage" isn't a sane security policy. What is a sane policy is fixing it so they can't take advantage - and if you can't fix it you isolate it from use until you can. You can't fix it, until you know there's a problem there... It's called being responsible. Why are you so eager to be irresponsible?

they use Jira to track bugs

So why isn't that used, instead? Seems to me to make a lot more sense to keep such all in the same place. It makes actually tracking the bugs easy instead of convoluted. In addition to the previously posed questions regarding this, I would also like to know: Would there be any reason why it was decided to intentionally avoid open source software?

 I also have my own less involved system of tracking bugs to follow up on

Why? why should this need two seperate and independant systems for the same task? It intentionally creates redundant workflow, gives twice the attack surface and over time becomes a traceability nightmare.

Jan 20, 17 / Aqu 20, 01 03:21 UTC

@ Ryan.zohar, could you clarify to me then what is VOA really ?.

I still do not understand why you say that the IT team does not need help. I see that there is much to do and there are people interested in helping but still we continue without joining forces.

I really do not know what to think at the moment, I would like you to help me remove from my head the idea that this project is being transformed into a ruling elite over the rest of future citizens.