Jun 10, 01 / May 30, 17 13:06 UTC

Re: Discussion of the draft Constitution  

@Ewe Thor

I very much like the idea of the neutral pronoun "ehs". 

In fact I think I'll integrate it into the Skieswanne-Ghodrati Constitution Draft. Anyone in favour?

Jun 10, 01 / May 30, 17 13:32 UTC

@Dmitry Novoseltsev(Asgardian) on 30 May 2017, 5:55 a.m.

What I meant was, can be viewed here (http://i4is.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/Principium17%201705170945.opt.pdf, pp. 30-35) or at the engineering forum topic "Catalysis: project for future."

Thank you, Dmitry! That was a fascinating read! What would you project the cost of constructing, launching, and monitoring such Sower, Keeper, and Memory Fleet vehicles?

  Last edited by:  user 125756 (Asgardian)  on Jun 10, 01 / May 30, 17 13:34 UTC, edited 2 times in total.

Jun 10, 01 / May 30, 17 15:04 UTC

@LoreZyra - At this stage I can't appreciate it. 

I can only say that the cost will be relatively small, because it is essentially about mass production of a large number of quite simple devices of the same type.

It is now necessary to study the project, and I'm trying to interest them in specialized structures like Breakthrough Initiatives. 

This theme also resonates with the paragraph in the draft of the Constitution, which declares the right of citizens to the memory after death - it is possible to collect and disseminate of an Asgardian citizen database.

Jun 10, 01 / May 30, 17 15:13 UTC

Question for the Mods

Will the vote be "anonymous"?

Jun 10, 01 / May 30, 17 18:33 UTC

Voting yes is a required step to citizenship according to the direction laid out so far. Can't be anonymous and still validate citizenship.


Jun 10, 01 / May 30, 17 19:11 UTC

Why not to use simple "person" insted of he/she?

Jun 10, 01 / May 30, 17 19:41 UTC

 [quote] thymeless(Asgardian) on 30 May 2017, 6:33 p.m.                                            

Voting yes is a required  step to citizenship according to the direction laid out so far. Can't  be anonymous and still validate citizenship. [/quote]

I am aware. What happens if a person doesn't vote? Again, for a Mod to answer

Jun 10, 01 / May 30, 17 19:42 UTC

@Dmitry
'Cause sometimes the sentence's structure needs an "he" or a "she". I would like to have only sentences requiring "person", as I personally prefer it but, as far as I know, it simply can't be done.

@Dmitry Novoseltsev & @skieswanne
I proposed the neologism without explaining it.
So, I noticed both uses: he/she and (less frequent) (s)he, that brought me to think "he" is included into "she" so, using "she" can mean both. But, as for the way we use the language, "she" means "she" only, and not "she". So, to cope with the popular use of the language, I tried thinking something not too different and, at the same time, we can seamless adopt into Basic (which I think at, like as Unish: extensible).
That line of thinking generated ehs, which includes both "eh" and "she" in some way, but in a different way of how "she" included both ones.
Far more complicate to explain that to use. :D

Jun 10, 01 / May 30, 17 20:35 UTC

A MONARCHY ?

Who's the king ? Igor 1st ?

Jun 10, 01 / May 30, 17 21:24 UTC

English: I am disagree in two points:

1) Article 2: Asgardia must not be a monarchy, it must be a republic. 

2) Article 34.3: The Members of Parliament should be elected with 18 years, not 50.

Spanish: Estoy en desacuerdo en dos puntos:

1) Artículo 2: Asgardia no debe ser una monarquía, debe ser una república.

2) Artículo 34.3: Los Diputados deberían ser elegidos con 18 años, no 50.

  Last edited by:  96yeyo (Asgardian)  on Jun 10, 01 / May 30, 17 21:25 UTC, edited 1 time in total.

Jun 10, 01 / May 30, 17 23:01 UTC

About the question of the Age: We're going right true a gerontocracy or what? I'm not at all against the idea of an assembly like the Royal Council composed of person older than 50, to be a sort of Senate that will guarantee and guarantee the basic rights. The Parliament in exchange have to be opened to people over 25 years old at most. 


Maybe a stupid question, but how will we vote?

Jun 10, 01 / May 30, 17 23:07 UTC

Hello Asgardians.

I share what seems to be overwhelming dissatisfaction with this draft. It looks silly, almost like it is from sort of second rate children's science fiction book, and I'm afraid that if the referendum is not postponed there might not be enough time to fix it.

Fellow Asgardians seem to have already pointed out all of the problems with it, so I would like to suggest some possible solutions. Specifically for the issue of disbanding the parliament and removal of the HoS from office. For instance, the HoS can propose the disbandment of the parliament. He could suspend it for a short period of time, several weeks to a month. At the end of that period a referendum is held. At that referendum one of two things happens: either the parliament is disbanded, or the HoS is removed from office. The same thing happens if the parliament proposes that the head of state is removed from his position: a referendum is held in which of of two things happens: either the HoS is removed or the parliament is disbanded. 

For these referendums a 60% majority is needed. If there is no 60% majority for either of the options (HoS goes or parliament is disbanded), new elections are automatically called for and held as soon as possible, for both parliament and HoS. 

If you are wondering why I think this system is probably good, the answer is because I think there should be a political cost and risk that would prevent political machinations and power struggles, as well as giving the citizens the final word in important matters like this. This is also me thinking out loud and throwing ideas here for brainstorming. This might be a good or terrible idea. You decide.

I would like to add one more thing—please calm down with the gender neutral stuff. I have nothing against people's rights, but the whole right vs left, liberal vs conservative, extreme ideologies and the clash between these two polar opposites is not a good template for uniting humanity. Asgarida should be a nation of common sense, pragmatical thinking, freedom of thought and expression, not of thought police and hysterical paranoia over pronouns. Personally I think a good solution for the gender pronoun issue is not a gender neutral one, but using both. So for instance everywhere where we would have a “he” we would instead have “he or she.” 

My two cents. 

  Last edited by:  Aleksandar Neshkovski (Asgardian)  on Jun 10, 01 / May 30, 17 23:09 UTC, edited 1 time in total.

Jun 11, 01 / May 31, 17 01:51 UTC

After acepting the Asgardian constitution i would be an asgardian citizen?

Jun 11, 01 / May 31, 17 02:58 UTC

@96yeyo "The Members of Parliament should be elected with 18 years, not 50."

I'll try again to convey the thesis of the redundancy of the age limit.

Advancing in Parliament, you will have to present and defend your program, and possibly to participate in the debate. 

If you are 10 years old, you are not can to do it. If the 18 - may be able. If 50 is too, most likely, will be able, though not necessarily, people are different, some to old age are not getting smarter (I hope that the citizens of Asgardia are not this case). Without this you can't be elected. 

But if you 10 years and you still have made and defended the program - so, you're a genius and you have the right to be elected.

Jun 11, 01 / May 31, 17 07:25 UTC

Not being a professional lawyer, I want to note some points in part of the project related to justice (articles 37, 38, 40). Such close attention to the court and Prosecutor's office in the draft Constitution at all seems a little sinister – I would suggest all the "police" part to minimize and to bring in a separate legislation. Alarming theses about the interaction with law enforcement agencies of other States. Although the draft Constitution is literally forbidden prisons and other reprisals, under a certain interpretation it remains possible to give these functions “for outsourcing” – especially that there is at least one state, willingly pursuing and arresting people all over the planet, regardless of their nationality and location.

At the same time, to prevent possible abuse, I would like to supplement these sections with the following principles.

  • - Right and duty of citizens of Asgardia is the need for the possibility of a voluntary settlement of any conflict situations with the participation of citizens groups or public entities based on mutual interests without the involvement of formal law enforcement structures of Asgardia.

  • - The reasoned intervention of law-enforcement structures are possible only on the initiative of citizens or their groups, and the initiators take the responsibility for the possible consequences.

  • - Unreasonable and unwarranted involvement and interference of law enforcement agencies is unacceptable and constitutes an offence and a violation of fundamental rights and freedoms of citizens.

(This is not an idle thought. Only recently had to decide such a complex and unpleasant issue in respect of a close relative. The possibility of any action for false accusation of Asgardia should be excluded).